Tiger Woods, Phil Mickelson and Michelle Wie all share PGA immortality

Michelle and Ty Tryon.
Hank Haney was on Charlie Rose the other night and said Tiger's handicap is +10 which he computed based on many rounds they played together. Tiger is a lot better than anyone else and will likely win 20 majors the next 10 years.
Michelle will go the way of Mr. Tryon.
The U.S. Open may have finished Phil cause he knows Tiger would never, ever, blow a major like he did.

Tiger is just sandbagging Haney to get him to ante up more in the round.

How does a PGA scoring average of 68.11 equate into a USGA handicap of plus 10? Tiger must only play good when someone shows him the money :-)

To think Michelle will turn into another Ty might be true if she only played in men's events exclusively.

Michelle more than holds her own against the best female golfers in the world and would have easily qualified for a Fully Exempt LPGA card for 2007 is she were a member. She earned enough money in only eight events to hold 13th place on the ADT money list if a member at (yes) 16 years old.

I believe there are many women professional golfers playing on other tours and the LPGA tour who respect how Michelle has taken advantage of so few opportunities. Most of them could never hope to have such a successful season.

We can only imagine what level of success she could achieve playing a full schedule exclusively on the LPGA tour, but I would wager she would finish in the top five of the end of season ADT standings at (yes) a 17 year old.

To think otherwise is quite ridiculous.

The difference between Wie and Tryon - She got her 20M to fall back on. He got nothing after overdrafting his potentials.

One-Putt says "We can only imagine what level of success she could achieve playing a full schedule exclusively on the LPGA tour, but I would wager she would finish in the top five of the end of season ADT standings at (yes) a 17 year old."

I would agree. The problem is that BJ/Sony/Nike are pushing her into deeper waters where she has been struggling. Forget all that "It's her choice" crap. How many of us were choosing our destinies at 13-years old? BJ saw a chance to milk his daughter's talents and has been doing it for years. Unfortunately, he forgot that his daughter is still a little girl in many ways, and her maturity has lagged behind her talent. At this point, she is going backwards.

Though Carolyn Bivens has been Cruella deVil through all of this, blaming her doesn't make any sense. Would BJ have put Michelle into the LPGA fulltime if they had allowed it? Probably not, so they had no reason to bend the rules for her. If the LPGA did accept her petition to play, they likely would've asked for a minimum number of entries, which BJ would've scoffed at.

Tiger's handicapp is based only on tournament scores achieved on the toughest course layouts in the world--I think what Mr. Haney was trying to say is that on a neutral course Tiger would be 10 strokes better than your average scratch golfer. Not the same as an actual +10 handicapp, but telling as to his actual skill level all the same.

Todd, your opinion is that everyone is "pushing" Michelle. My opinion is that
Michelle is doing what she wants to do, with the full support of her parents
and her sponsors. If her father was just trying to "milk" his daughter's talent,
he would have pulled her out of high school and made her join the LPGA full-
time. Isn't that where she would have made the most money? Obviously,
making the most money is not their priority. Perhaps Michelle just wants to
blaze a new path by being the first competitive female on the men's tour.
I truly believe that her goal is to be known as a great golfer; not just a great
female golfer. What is so wrong with that? I applaud her courage at her age.
I think she knows she has a chance to make history, and she is going for it.
Let's not discourage her dreams.

Todd please don't try to place Michelle in the same box as you would a normal American 13 year old. What drives Michelle is the Korean blood that pumps through her veins, not her Korean parents.

When Michelle made 5 out of six cuts and finished in 9th place in a LPGA Major as a 13 year old, her destiny was set in motion. She would never be satisfied playing against girls her own age again. Age thirteen was also when Michelle last missed a LPGA cut. She had made golf history at 13 and the media went into a frenzy.

There is no denying Michelle improved her game each year she has played against the older girls while appearing in only eight events a season.

There is no mystery why Michelle will play in men's events when asked by a Sponsor to appear. She is after all a student of golf and you learn far more about your game and or weaknesses when you test yourself against the best.

Ron, even if B.J. Wie could have pulled Michelle out of high school,
the LPGA still would not have allowed her to become a full-fledged member
until she was officially 18 (or perhaps, with special dispensation, 17).

She also doesn't necessarily make her most money when she plays on the
LPGA tour, but just to appear at certain events.

The winner of the LPGA event usually only comes out with about $250k but
Michelle received $1.5 million just for attending the Casio World Open!

Michelle lost every major amateur tournament she entered , including all the biggies after the age of thirteen. These losses were to her peers not to seasoned pros. Michelle and her father brilliantly marketed her as a trailblazer and a pioneer, but the facts are that for all her talent she never really had much success against the top junior and amateur players, so to say that she was too good or would not be satisfied is not entirely true. She has showed that she can hold her own against the best players in the world, but since she made "golf history" she has not proved she can beat them, at least not all of them.

One-Putt

Can we please abandon the silly notion that Michelle is benifiting from getting humiliated by the men. Golf is played against the course, and her future and only chances to win will be on LPGA setups not PGA course layouts, so no help there. We have all seen that her game is not ready, so why doesn't she show that she can win against the ladies first...Oh yeah, that's right Michelle doesn't like to actually accomplish things, I forgot she's a trailblazer who gets credit and applause for just showing up. Enough already!

To correct two posters :
Ty Tryon got millions when he turned pro.
Haney said Tiger's handicap was +10. He didn't say it might be +10, could be +10, or would be +10. He said he computed it based on rounds they played together at Isleworth and other courses they play. Remember the USGA handicap system is based on a percentage of your rounds, not an average of all your rounds. The average tour player is probably about +5.

Let Wie drop for God sakes...

Wonder why most of the BS is taking place in the world? Publicity. If Fox and CNN was not covering all the middle east crap.....

Not worth wasting time with you people.

Drop Wie columns for God sakes....

Sorry Bill, no can do for now, but I intend to focus my energy elsewhere after
Wie makes her final men's tournament appearance of the year. ;-)

"Comment from: Seve [Visitor]

One-Putt

Can we please abandon the silly notion that Michelle is benifiting from getting humiliated by the men. Golf is played against the course, and her future and only chances to win will be on LPGA setups not PGA course layouts, so no help there. We have all seen that her game is not ready, so why doesn't she show that she can win against the ladies first...Oh yeah, that's right Michelle doesn't like to actually accomplish things, I forgot she's a trailblazer who gets credit and applause for just showing up. Enough already!"

Seve give me your opinion on what Michelle should do as a professional in order to play in more than six LPGA exempted events and the US and British Women's Opens?

Maybe Michelle could play on exemption with the Ladies European Tour? Nope they are tied to the US LPGA Tour. How about the Japan or Australian LPGA Tours? Again they are linked to the US LPGA Tour in a monopoly of sorts on women's professional golf. An exemption in one is an exemption for all.

The doors are closed to Michelle by the Ladies Tours for her to appear in more events. So as long as the Sponsors keep offering exemptions in men's events she will continue to play to get in some competative rounds in during the year.

A practice round with Sergio Garcia is something most 16 year old golfers don't dream of and he gave Michelle some good advice while playing the practice round and at lunch later. Sergio turned out to be somewhat of a Prophet when he predicted she would have difficulty because of her low ball flight at the Omega.

Perhaps you have some suggestions for Michelle Seve?

When Hank Haney said Tiger is a Plus(+) 10, that means that 'he is giving the golf course the strokes.' He is not saying that Tiger is a 10+ handicapper.

For regular golfer's handicaps, the course 'gives them the strokes'. In the case of professional golfers, they 'give' the courses strokes.

Look at this another way, Hank Haney could have said Tiger is a minus 10. Then most people would probably can follow the logic better.

Since Wie was mentioned in the same article...She is about a +2.

There's one thing I want to mention. Whether or not you agree with Bubbles' quite quixotic quest, the notion that she is just "doing what she wants to do" is no justification for anything.

Kids want to do lots of things that are bad for them and/or others; this is why they have parents. Or, they're supposed to, anyway. One of the problems with parenting nowadays is that parents kowtow to their children's whimsy, behaving immaturely themselves in their callow belief that their progeny's "feelings" trump all other concerns.

Lastly, the world doesn't have to relegate other priorities to the back burner and roll out a red carpet simply because some media creation has ambitions. Heck, everyone has ambitions. Success is built on far more than that.

"Comment from: Judge Smails [Visitor]
There's one thing I want to mention. Whether or not you agree with Bubbles' quite quixotic quest, the notion that she is just "doing what she wants to do" is no justification for anything."

As an amateur Michelle used professional event Sponsors as an avenue to play in more mainland amateur events. In-turn Sponsors used Michelle's golf skill and reputation when she appeared in their event.

The R of G section on amateur status, whereas rule 4 (expenses) allow event sponsors to pay reasonable expenses for travel, lodging, meals and other expenses for her and one adult chaperone, gave Michelle the resources she needed to play amateur golf outside of Hawaii. The timing of Michelle's professional appearances were linked to certain amateur events she appeared in on the mainland US.

Although the Wie's would never admit it (Korean pride), family economics drove the Wie's toward the professional tours.

Many notable amateur golfers take advantage of Amateur Rule 4 to underwrite their amateur appearances.

The stakes have changed now for Michelle as a professional golfer and for her to play in at least the same number of events she did as an amateur, she uses appearances in men's events to augment her schedule. You really can't expect a professional golfer to appear in only eight events a year.

Using, is not a one-way street in the world of professional golf.

One-Putt, "Family economics" drove the Wie's toward the professional tours? Are you implying that the senior Wie's were subject to some extreme financial hardship? Unless I am mistaken, isn't Bubbles an only child who had two gainfully employed parents who are professionals? I hadn't heard that explanation before. But therein lies the difference in perception. What you call dire necessity, I call exploitation.What you call "Korean pride", I call greed.

Alex,

Haven't you heard? Only white men can be greedy. When it's a minority such as Koreans, it's "pride." LOL.

"Comment from: Judge Smails [Visitor]
Alex,

Haven't you heard? Only white men can be greedy. When it's a minority such as Koreans, it's "pride." LOL."

Showed your bigoted ass again eh?

If you are able to remove your lips from Alex's butt for a moment and look around you might realize whitey is becoming the minority in the good ole USA. In another 10 years you will be marching on Washington demanding your civil rights. Remember South Africa? Those white folks thought they had it under control.

I guess you could always move back to the Old Country, but in 15 years you would be worshiping Mohammad in Old Europe.

Now, now, One-Putt, control yourself. There is nothing to be gained by hurling insults at other posters. You're beginning to come off as another Ghet Rheel. Since you seem to know quite a lot about the personal lives of all of the Wie's, perhaps you will condescend to answer a few questions about that family. For instance, are either of Bubbles' parents still employed in their occupations that they had before Bubbles signed on with Nike and Omega? How is it that Bubbles will be allowed to miss four full weeks of school in this year's first semester and maintain a 3.8 GPA? Admittedly, I was raised in a pretty tough neighborhood, but anybody who was absent to that extent for any reason where I went to highschool would have been taking that grade over. And in that same neighborhood , any man who used his daughter to further his own economic well-being would not have been known as a devoted Korean father, but by a four-letter word that begins and ends with the letter "p".

One-Nut,

I know better than you what the nature of the decline of western civilization is. I also know that it's you and your ilk who have visited our insane immigration policies upon us. However, I also know that there are more possibilities for the future than most prognosticators envision. Many things can upset the rotten apple cart.

Oh, I don't think I have my lips on anyone's posterior, but wherever they are, it's better than having them planted on Bubbles' backside.

I hate everything.

"Comment from: Judge Smails [Visitor] I know better than you what the nature of the decline of western civilization is. I also know that it's you and your ilk who have visited our insane immigration policies upon us. However, I also know that there are more possibilities for the future than most prognosticators envision. Many things can upset the rotten apple cart.

Oh, I don't think I have my lips on anyone's posterior, but wherever they are, it's better than having them planted on Bubbles' backside."

You must mean "the decline of white civilization". The real Western Civilization was doing quite well before the white people from the East landed to plunder the wealth, exterminate the people and steal the lands. I seem to recall reading that this was all done in the name of God.

We are once again faced with the name of God (Allah), being used as a means to justify the end.

I must say; at least Michelle does not need to shave her butt before I kiss it.

One-Putt, I don't know where to begin with your version of history. Especially that part about the "real Western Civilization doing quite well" before the evil white people conquered and plundered the peace-loving, tolerant, and progressive Native Americans, i.e., Indians. So I won't even try. As for Bubbles not having to shave her butt before you kiss it, I believe you, but do you know this firsthand?

Alex,

Trust me, he knows it firsthand.

On a different note, Alex, a study was just released wherein it is stated that the testosterone levels of men seem to have declined during the past couple of decades. I mention this because I think it may explain the existence of the limp-wristed, pusillanimous liberals we are beset by nowadays.

Perhaps ol' One-Nut should have his testosterone levels checked.

One-Nut,

Like Alex, I'm not so taken with my powers of persuasion that I think myself capable of disabusing you of your misbegotten notions. I will mention one small fact about we evil white people, however. To whit: whites were not the first people to practice slavery, but they were the first ones to outlaw it.

"To whit: whites were not the first people to practice slavery, but they were the first ones to outlaw it."

White folks just changed the name to "outsourcing" to keep their hands clean. To whit; whites continue to line their pockets while closing their eyes to the conditions created by their greed.

I was only using a metaphor for I would never kiss the butt any child or adult.

One-Nut,

If you wish to find slavery, you don't need to entertain grand rationalizations. You need look no further than Africa, the Middle East and Asia.

Now you can crawl back down into the rabbit hole.

Judge Smails, There's some delicious irony in One-Putt's convoluted rants. On one hand he heaps praise on Bubbles for the "Korean blood that pumps through her veins." He also extols her virtues as a trailblazer who makes millions, especially in the Orient, just by her presence. He obviously likes Koreans. Bubbles' and Bo's millions, why they are just ancillary, no greed there. He also likes American Indians, who, in his somewhat jaded opinion, had a flourishing and enlightened civilization in full swing before some evil, greedy white men and their equally evil, greedy white women invaded and and enslaved the docile, peace-loving natives. Of course, One-Putt's idea of
civilization is considerably different than that of most people.
The "civilization" of the Indians did not have such mundane exigencies as roads, infrastructure, transportation systems, permanent buildings, and anything but the most primitive agriculture and animal husbandry. They weren't bothered with recording their glorious history either since they had no codified written language, preferring instead the time-honored and reliable method of recording history through the spoken word of shamans and medicine men. To his eternally credit, Sequoyah did attempt to set down a crude Indian language after being impressed with that of the white men.They also weren't much on musical composition, sculpture , architecture, science,or art. Very few of the tribes had even seen the wheel. But, what the hell, nobody's perfect. Some of the things they did have were incessant tribal wars, human sacrifice, a total lack of education, the constant fear of famine, a complete lack of any type of health care, and abominable treatment of women. One-Putt finds nothing wrong with that type of "civilization."
But One-Putt excoriates the evil "white folk" for all the ills on the planet. White men are the scourge of humankind, conquerers and exploiters of the more civilized and peace-loving races. Koreans, Native Americans, and militant Muslims are to be much preferred. White men are bigots, the rest of the world is tolerant. No hypocrisy here.

Very well said, Alex. What's ironic is that the people who truly reject modern technology and hew to their own heritage, such as the Amish, don't usually condemn the progenitors of that technology. On the other hand, anti-white guttersnipes like One-Nut always seems to love the fruits of the malevolent white man's brainchildren. I grew up in the Bronx, and I can't tell you how many anti-white black fellows just LOVED European cars, even going to far as to extend themselves finanacially to aquire an old model Mercedes or BMW. I wonder if One-Nut is happy that a couple of white guys invented the computer?

Another thing that's interesting about One-Nut is that he doesn't seem to understand that to which "western civilization" refers. He doesn't seem to realize that it refers to the civilization that originated in Europe, one whose major players of antiquity were people's such as the Greeks and Romans.

One-Nut, I'm curious, where did your ancestors hail from? And, of course, I mean prior to their arrival on the shores of this nation that you hate so much but would never leave.

If non-whites dislike whites, here is a list of things they should do, or else
they are hypocrits:

1. Cease to play golf. It was invented by white people.

2. Cease to drive cars. Whites invented those.

3. Cease to enjoy air travel. Whites invented it.

4. Strip off the white man's clothes and put your grass skirts back on.

5. Recommence cannibalism. Whitey's christianity tried to put a stop to it.

6. You watch TV? Get rid of it, hypocrit!

7. You listen to the radio, CDs or cassettes? You know the drill.

8. Pre-natal care. Non-whites must reject this oppressive perk!

9. I'm getting bored........I'll get to 100 and have another million to go.

Wie is as American as your Thanksgiving apple pie. She is as American as Kristi Yamaguchi and Michelle Kwan which all Americans embraced. On the other hand, Wayne Gretzky and Steve Nash are Canadians, and NOT as American as Wie.

If you want to talk about blood line, Tiger has 'Thai blood' in his veins. Why does it matter? I do not think being half Black, half Thai has much influence in his talents.

Mohamed, Whatever type of blood that Bubbles or Woods or anyone else has coursing through his or her veins means nothing to me. Apparently it means quite a lot to A guy like One-Putt.

Mohamed,

While Bubbles certainly could be as American as apple pie, I can't forget the comments her father(I believe it was him) made wherein he stated that she was "Korean," as he played down her Americanism. And here I'll hark back to something Teddy Roosevelt said when railing against hyphenated Americanism: "Anyone who says he is American but something else also, isn't American at all."

So, since I'm intellectually honest, I can't call Bubbles "as American as apple pie." That is, unless you know of a pie that calls itself Korean-American apple pie.

Of course, this has nothing to do with race. Sadly, most "Americans" have been conditioned to think of themselves as a something-American.

Alex and Judge Smails,

I think there are great white Americans that identify themselves as hyphenated Americans just as much as the visible. For example, the Kennedys are proud Irish-Americans. Not to mention all the great Italian-Americans.

What shapes a person's outlook in life and behavior is their upbringing and parenting at home. It has very little to do with whether they are Korean or any other race. If Wie were born and raised in Korea, he would have been just another faceless Korean players. Though with her height, she probably would have ended up playing basketball than golf in Korea. It is being raised in America that gives her the exposure and the opportunity to be where she is today. It is no small wonder that most people would not make it big until they could 'bring it' in America. No one can deny that.

BTW, I am pretty sure that Wie's professor dad probably fed her some thing else to make her grow to 6'1". Or perhaps they fed her volcanic ash.

Mohamed,

Obviously you did not read my post. So, I suppose there's no point in my spending much more time with you.

Hey Judge Smails, I am not disagreeing with you. If Wie Sr wants to dissociate himself with America, then I think he should take his family and move to Korea where hopefull his family could feel at home and 'flourish'.

All I was trying to point out was that the use of hyphenated American is not the exclusivity of Koreans.

Yes, Mohamed, and if you would have read the last paragraph of my post, you would know that I made the same point.

Judge Smails, To return to topic, One-Putt has portrayed the white man (and woman) as the quintessential villain in world history. What he very conveniently neglects to mention is that "whitey", as he condescendingly refers to the largest and most productive segment of American people, is responsible for about 95% of all the inventions, medical breakthroughs, literature, architecture, musical composition, and virtually everything worthwhile now extant. White men are far from perfect, but they are still head and shoulders ahead of whomever is second.

No doubt, Alex. And in all seriousness, I think part of the genesis of people like One-Putt's antipathy toward white people is envy. You know, it's Halloween, so maybe he'll dress up as a white businessman in a three-piece suit or as a white scientist. It may buttress his self-esteem.

my wife helps a friend of hers who happens to be 101 years old.

she is a great fan of tiger woods. in 101 years she has never played golf but
loves tiger. is it possible to send or get a tiger wood soveigner from the pga
for her. would like to get something by christmas

rudy, I'm not sure, but offhand I would say it isn't possible. The PGA, along with all other major sports organizations, would simply have too many such requests to attempt to fill them. By the way rudy, is your capital key broken? How about your spell check? Punctuation?

Aussie golf handicaps are based on every competition score. Each course is
given a daily rating after each comp. equating to the average of the top 15%
of nett scores. E.g., my course often has a rating 3-4 below its official par.
Tiger certainly could not maintain a +10 handicap here! He'd need to shoot
14 below par every single round! I know a 14-year-old lad (Danny An) who
has a +2 handicap and played all four rounds in the 2006 Australian Open
alongside the likes of Greg Norman and Wayne Grady. Danny at age 12
played to scratch and won numerous junior and open tournamnets.
What was Tiger's (or Nicklaus') handicap at that age?