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67 comments

Comment from: John Z [Visitor]
Brandon, In answer to your question, it is very possible and even likely that Michelle Wie would not have won the US Women's Amateur even if she had played in it for this year and next, but she should have been playing in it anyway. To have a girl like Michelle playing as a pro in tournaments around the world when she hadn't even completed her junior year in highschool is an abomination that should never be repeated. Her greedy parents have robbed their own daughter of her adolescent years. She will never get them back. This type of child exploitation was and is common in figure skating, gymnastics and swimming and diving. Now, overly zealous parents have started to push their teen and even pre-teen daughters in golf. This sort of thing should be banned as soon as possible by the commissioners of the various tours. A young woman or man should at least be out of highschool before competing against adults. Even the greedy NBA has that rule. For those who defend this pimping of the children, and that's all that it is, I say that you simply don't know or refuse to acknowledge the potential psychological damage that can be done to an adolescent girl with this kind of constant pressure. Don't even bother with that business of how much money she makes. Teenage girls are not supposed to make money for their greedy parents. Michelle and Morgan Pressel both seem like nice kids no matter what these blogs put up. We can only hope that the damage to their self-esteem is not irreparable.
08/07/06 @ 11:27
Comment from: Ron Mon [Member] Email
The question is not "should," but rather, "could." Yes, she won the Pub, but she beat Virada in the final, and Virada is only a middling pro at best, so far.
08/07/06 @ 12:08
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
Brandon,

No she shouldn't have stayed in amateurs.
The old argument of winning amateurs = success at the pro level is an old tired and useless argument.

Tiger Woods did do the amateur thing and go onto success. However if Tiger Woods had entered the Hooters Tour, he probably would have still went on and had plenty of success.

On the other hand, take many of the US Womens Amatuer Winners:
2005 Morgan Pressel
2004 Virada Nirathingy
Can anyone name any more?

What success have they had?
08/07/06 @ 12:47
Comment from: Jim C [Visitor]
JOHN Z contradicts himself.

He says Michelle Wie should be competing in this year's Women's Amateur, and later he he says a young man or woman should at least be out of high school before competing against adults. Isn't the Women's Amateur an adult competition?

08/07/06 @ 13:05
Comment from: John Z [Visitor]
Jim C, That is the exact type of hair splitting that people like you thrive on. You don't address the issue of an adolescent girl trying to compete against men, unsuccessfully I might add, you instead are worried about my choice of words. You people are the reason why I don't post on the threads very much. Like your friend Norman you have the notion that girls like Michelle Wie or Morgan Pressel are mature enough to handle this much pressure. They are not. Maybe there is one teenage girl in the world who wouldn't be stressed out by the pressure but neither of these two girls are that person. I've had some experience dealing with teens of both genders who had pushy parents like these two, and the results have always been way below expectations and frequently the teen becomes alienated of the sport that he or she was being pushed into. If you folks think it can't happen to Michelle Wie, you have your heads in the sand.
08/07/06 @ 13:28
Comment from: Jim C [Visitor]
John Z

In your first post you said nothing about competing against men--and it is your opinion that she has done so unsuccessfully. Her fans understand that she is only a 16 year old girl, and do not consider her to be a failure just because she has yet to make a PGA cut.

It is not Michelle Wie's family or her supporters who quote Vince Lombardi about winning being the only thing--it is Wie's critics. There would be a lot less pressure on Michelle Wie if the criticisms directed at her when she fails to win an LPGA event or when she misses a PGA event would be no more than those directed at Annika or Karrie Webb when they miss LPGA cuts.






08/07/06 @ 14:21
Comment from: John Z [Visitor]
Jim C, You make it plain that you just don't want to read or hear the obvious, that Michelle Wie and other teen girls like her should never be put under that kind of pressure. And I emphasize the word NEVER. Her parents are the culprits here, not her fans or her critics or anybody posting on these blogs. Even a person like you cannot deny that Michelle has been robbed of her teen years by pushy and greedy parents. The same goes for Morgan Pressel and any other girl or even a boy who was similarly exploited. I don't expect any of you real zealots to admit this. Instead you will say she gave a lot of money to hurricane victims and more such irrational BS to justify her parents' greed. Her agents and handlers suggested the charitable donations as a PR stunt and you guys fell for it. Your comparing the treatment of Annika and Karrie by news media and fans is ludicrous. Annika and Karrie are mature women and thus able to take more criticism than Michelle who is an adolescent girl, Big difference.
08/07/06 @ 15:14
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
Alot of people just don't get it.

Stuart Appleby said before Michelle's first pga attempt, that she was a good player and it was good that she would get that particular exemption in her home event.

He said she was an excellent player, so good infact that he thought she would shoot two nice scores in the 80s.

Perhaps you'll look at that and think that was silly, but at that time, most players would have thought that anything breaking 80 would be a monumental achievement for a girl of 14 years of age. Of course she did quite a bit better than that.

That's what people don't get. They have expectations that Michelle should make pga cuts easily. What has been lost in the debate, is that it is amazing that she can compete so well to get near a cut against that standard of competition.

Michelle is a terrific golfer. People have their own agendas if they critisise her, and it has absolutely nothing to do with her golf.
08/07/06 @ 16:23
Comment from: Jim C [Visitor]
I wouldn't mind getting rid of Little League, and I certainly don't support the idea of a Little League World Series.

I don't think Brittany Lincicmoe was exploited by her parents who sacrificed so she could pursue her dreams. I see nothing wrong with Brittany playing on her high school boys golf team. But I have to wonder when I read that Brittany played in more than 100 tournaments as an amateur before she turned pro shortly after her 19th birthday.

Junior golf needs to address the issue of the pressure on young golfers to play in an excessively high number of tournaments. And there certainly needs to be an end to ranking systems which pressure young golfers to play in a lot tournaments if they want a high ranking. Certianly in the case of girls, opportujnities to compete with boys at a local level should reduce the need for massive numbers of junior events that lead to touring 9 and 10 year olds.
08/07/06 @ 16:31
Comment from: John Z [Visitor]
Norman and Jim C, Both of you are Wie zealots who I am sure have no experience in coaching or training young people in any sport. When any young person is put under such pressure to excel, regardless of who applies the pressure, more times than not the results are negative. And please don't tell me that Michelle's parents, especially her father, haven't exposed her to excessive pressure. Her father is a text book case of an overbearing father who wants to be seen as having nothing but the best interests of his daughter in mind. All the evidence of Mr. Wie's domination of Miss Wie are there to see, but you Wie zealots refuse to see it. I know that you folks will not agree with anything I've written so I'll make this my final say on the subject. I really hope that Miss Wie comes through her teen years with her emotions in tact, but in my somewhat educated opinion it doesn't look good for her. I think it us a case of too much too soon, and pushing a kid beyond her limts.
08/07/06 @ 17:32
Comment from: Ron [Visitor]
I hear so many people accuse Michelle's parents (mostly her father) of expoloiting their daughter because of greed, and robbing her or her childhood. If this was the case, they simply would have pulled her out of high school so she could play more, and asked for an exemption to the LPGA. How is going to college a part of this exploitation? John Z, have you spoken to BJ Wie personally, or Michelle for that matter, to back up your accusations? Michelle Wie is a kid, yes, but I think she loves the game of golf and all the pressure that comes with it. She obviously is someone who loves a challenge and knows she could rewrite the history books. I don't believe her father controls her life to the degree you believe he does. If you can dispute this with facts, please enlighten me.
08/07/06 @ 17:38
Comment from: Go Michelle [Visitor]
All you guys should get a life and leave Michelle's parents alone. They and Michelle have the right to do what they think is best for them as a family. And you do too.

And raise your hands if you would turn down $10 million plus per year to have your child set for life you hypocrites

Winning at the amateur level seems to have hurt Morgan big time. She came to the LPGA a legend in her own mind. Look at her now!
08/07/06 @ 18:28
Comment from: Stephen [Visitor]
I don't think it's a useful discussion to ponder whether or not, Michelle Wie should have won US Amateur because she won the Women's Public Link and she's now a part-time professional. I agree that Mr. Wie's decisions to push his own daughter to try all kinds of venues is not in Michelle's best interests and developments. He has made a couple of comments that convinces me about his overbearing demands on his daughter. She has had to weather the questions and criticisms on her own, and people should have questioned her parents instead. She is a child who will do whatever to make her parents happy. It's clear that Michelle likes to golf and has an immense talent that should have been nurtured. It's disturbing to hear Mr. Wie's repeated complaints that "we're disappointed" even when his daughter had come in 2nd or 3rd in majors, when most parents would have been thrilled. It's obvious that Mr. Wie is in a terrible hurry to push his daughter all over the places, and also rushing her to college. She's only 16 once and will soon turn 17 once too. It's a credit to Michelle that she still seems well adjusted to all the pressures for now. She doesn't need to learn how to win under such public scrutiny of television and every critic's analyses. For her sake, I hope she enjoys her teen-age life, shool, and continues to develop her talent unfettered by parental and agents' pressures. I hope I'm wrong about Mr. Wie because Michelle deserves to grow up and develop at her own pace.
08/07/06 @ 18:37
Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
Ron, I've never personally spoken to BJ Wie, but I did see him in action once, at the Publinx near Cincinnati last year. He was cheerleading Bubbles as only a demented stage father would. He was talking loudly and moving around when the other players were putting. I don't have to know him personally to realize that BJ is a pompous and officious ass. He is also a money-grubbing vulture who has pimped his daughter to the highest bidder. Anybody, even an illiterate lamebrain like Go Michelle, should be able to see this. Stephen, you are not wrong about Mr. Wie. He is definitely an eight-ball, no question about it. If Bubbles survives her teen years with her emotions in tact it will be a bigger miracle than her winning on the PGA tour.
08/07/06 @ 18:58
Comment from: TW [Visitor]
John Z,

I have one question. Is what you said about Michelle's father not the same thing that Tiger's father did and even before he was a teen. I guess the same results can't happen huh? Is it because she a girl and Tiger is a man?
08/07/06 @ 18:58
Comment from: John M [Visitor]
Exactly what can Michelle's father gain by "exploiting" his daughter? He has just this ONE child. His life revolves around Michelle even though he had a career hiself. What could he POSSIBLY have in mind other than his daughter's happiness? That man "works" for his daughter, for god's sake! Look at his grey hair and sweat in his face standing right there next to Michelle at any given moment. I happened to check out some video clips of Michelle's appearance in a Korean game show (following a bloger's link) when she visited there, and boy, was she beaming and happy! The old dad and mom were in the audience, just lovingly watching their daughter having fun. Michelle enjoys everything that comes with her stardom. She thrives under pressure and watchful eyes. Get it?
08/07/06 @ 19:17
Comment from: Tanya [Visitor]
Wow. It is very funny how there are so many people in this comment stream that so readily rip the parents of Michelle Wie and with such vicious verbage. You people don't even know BJ and Bo Wie, you have no idea what went in to the decision making process or how the decision was made. You have no idea. Then you rip them for cheering their kid on while she is golfing. My child rides horses, she is five, when she does something great or has a "that was so cool, I was able to trot and post by myself!" look on her face I clap and yell "Yay!" She loves it, and every month I ask her..."do you want to ride this month? or do you miss playing with your friends after school on thursday." and every month she exlaims "I want to ride!" While this may not be related to making oodles of cash on a pro golf circuit, it does relate to parenting. For those who tell me that I push my daughter, to them I say that they have no idea what our relationship is like. To all of you who are ripping the Wies to shreds with ridiculous statements about the decision process that brought Michell into the pro circuit or the relationship between a child and her parents that you know anything about, I say before you throw stones you should cleanup your own glass house. Jealousy is not becoming and neither are vile and snide remarks.
08/07/06 @ 20:02
Comment from: Fed Up [Visitor]
Just what the world needed another Wie blog. People on both sides of the arguement are freaking loony tunes getting so worked up over some 16 year old girl. Get a life.
08/07/06 @ 20:11
Comment from: Jay [Visitor]
Exploitation ? Come on, wtf are you guys talkin about ? She is having a ball, playing golf she loves and making millions.

There was a time in the 18 C when kids were sent to factorys with horrible working conditions. That is exploitation.

Don't worry about her 'psychological damamge'. People vary in their tolerance level. If you are thrown in to a lion den with no prospect of winning, then that is psychological damage plus physical harm. However, if you are very very good at your trade and thrown into an arena, it can be good learning experience.

Going thru Junior/Ama level is just a stepping stone that is helpful but not absolutely needed. You can be US President going thru NYS senator as stepping stone, but if you didn't have to would you 'waste' your time doing that ?
08/07/06 @ 20:13
Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
TW, There is no comparison between the way the media treated Tiger and the hype that is being heaped on Bubbles. Woods won six junior and amateur titles before he turned pro. Won two PGA events in his rookie season to keep his card, otherwise he would have had to go to "Q" school. There was no where near the hype for Tiger as with Michelle. Anyone who thinks otherwise is dreaming. The Wie-wee's always point to Tiger Woods as an example of somebody who was highly touted and lived up to expectations. But for every Woods there are a few hundred thousand who don't make the grade. And, yes, there is a great difference between the sexes as far the ability to accept disappointment. Go to any girls' high school sporting events and watch the tears flow whether they win or lose.
08/07/06 @ 21:00
Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
Jay, Do you ever bother to read your stuff and edit it before posting? I realize that nobody expects perfection on an internet blog, but that last post of yours was barely intelligible. Please, if you want to be taken seriously, try to improve your writing. Thank you.
08/07/06 @ 21:11
Comment from: alan m [Visitor]
Why another Wie blog repeating the same issues and concerns about what she should or shouldn't be doing.
She is what she is. Drop the verbal garbage.
What about:-
Annika +7
Karen stupples +6
Natalie Gulbis +6
Christina Kim +11
All of these ladies had a chance of winning the Open.
Alan m
08/07/06 @ 21:18
Comment from: alan m [Visitor]
I am surprised there have been no comments about the latest world rankings. Young Wie down to No7.
Unfortunately for her detractors she has been so good that with only half the tournaments played in to maximise her average she is still ranked so high. Go Wie.
Alan m
08/07/06 @ 21:31
Comment from: TW [Visitor]
Alex,

I suggest you also learn to read what is written. I made no comparson between Tiger and Michelle. The comparsion was between how John Z indicated Michelle's father pushes her career and how Earl Wood pushed Tiger's. Really, I say fairly simular. But the real thing I was gettting at was he was indicating BJ's influnce would be damaging to Michelle. I was indicating the same type of influnce didn't hurt Tiger and I don't think it will hurt Michelle, even though she is a girl. So where did how the media get into your responce to me?
08/07/06 @ 22:16
Comment from: Jim C [Visitor]
We talked plenty about the upcoming change. I hadn't seen the actual ratings before I saw your post--but it certainly was no great surprise.

This should actually help Michelle, since she did not need the baggage from such a high rating.
08/07/06 @ 22:45
Comment from: Judge Smails [Visitor]
It's funny how some of you Wie-zeals act as if pushy, overbearing sports parents are a figment of our imagination when such people are legion and infamous. Alex has told you that he witnessed Bubbles' father's lunacy. Why do you doubt him?
08/08/06 @ 00:07
Comment from: Go Michelle [Visitor]
You are such a jerk Alex.Your comments are absolutely idiotic.
Get a life will you. I see nothing but your name when I view these blogs and I don't come often.
08/08/06 @ 00:10
Comment from: Go Michelle [Visitor]
Judge Small, what is lunacy for you and Alex, is for others, a proud father's reaction and excitement. What's wrong with that?

08/08/06 @ 00:52
Comment from: Jim C [Visitor]
Alex

I think Travel Golf talked about the difference between men and women in how they responded to adversity on the golf course. Women are more likely to cry, and men are more likely to break their golf clubs. I don't know about anyone else, but on my scale for accepting adversity the ladies get 100 and we men get ZERO.
08/08/06 @ 02:17
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
What a stupid argument. Why should Michelle play against lesser competition when she holds her own against the best women golfers in the world? Get a grip folks, she is in the top one percent of all women golfers worldwide and you want her to play against amateurs.

That is as stupid as thinking Brandon Tucker could win a Pulitzer.
08/08/06 @ 05:30
Comment from: Kyle [Visitor]

Alex,

You're a pathological liar, I highly doubt you've ever been around BJ Wie.

And if you were, what were you doing stalking him and his family ??
You seem to know their every move, and even know what they're thinking.

You're a total psycho - please don't delude yourself that anyone here takes you seriously.
08/08/06 @ 06:24
Comment from: Dave Marrandette [Visitor]
Brandon,

Thanks!
08/08/06 @ 08:38
Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
Kyle, This may come as a surprise to you, but when one is a spectator at a golf tournament, one frequently comes within arm's length of the golfers themselves including all the big names. Nothing at all unusual about that. BJ Wie never tries to hide his enthusiasm, which is understandable. But his actions when the other golfers are addressing the ball are so egregious that he has been chided by marshals several times. BJ Wie's antics have been witnessed by thousands of golf spectators and have been documented in several news articles and magazines including SI. The fact that you don't know this is testament to your abysmal ignorance on the subject.
08/08/06 @ 09:40
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
Comment by Judge Smails:
It's funny how some of you Wie-zeals act as if pushy, overbearing sports parents are a figment of our imagination when such people are legion and infamous. Alex has told you that he witnessed Bubbles' father's lunacy. Why do you doubt him?
*******************************

Hmm, why would we doubt Alex?

How about maybe that he is the biggest Wie critic on these boards.
He holds absolutely no imparitality on the subject whatsoever.

It is interesting to note though, that Alex went to an event to watch Michelle, and like all the other people watching her there, contributed to the hype.
Well done Alex, for helping the Wie hype machinge.
08/08/06 @ 11:25
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
GRAMMER POLICE:

That machinge should be machine obviously.
08/08/06 @ 11:35
Comment from: Jim C [Visitor]
There are two separate questions about BJ. (1) Did he push his daughter too hard as a sports stage father? and (2) Is he inconsiderate of other players on the course?


Evidence relating to the second question, whether it is accurate or not, tells us little about the first. Yes he was a pushy sports father like Tiger's father was. Yes the vast majority of children with pushy parents do not achieve great success--but Michelle is one of the few who have. Figure skating was mentioned. Michelle's father may be like a lot of figure skating mother's. I have heard nothing to indicate that he was like Tonya Harding's mother.

As long as issues of golf etiquette have been raised, I have some issues on this subject. On Friday Morgan Pressel was 7 over for the last two holes. Suppose one of her playing partners had mentioned this to her on the 17th tee on Saturday? Would that be ethical?

There is probably no rule against a player saying that, but it would seem to be poor sportsmanship. Yet that is basically what Morgan Pressel did when she talked in Sports Illustrated about how not enough attention was being given to Wie's final round of 82--although I put much more blame on SI for publishing the comments than on Pressel for making them.

Michelle Wie has not won a tournament since the 2003 Women's Pub Links--but she has been able to put up a lot of high finishes at the highest level of women's golf. When people constantly focus on Wie's lack of wins, I consider it to be poor sportsmanship of much the same type as that of the hypothetical player who referred to Morgan Pressel's problems on the last two holes. OBVIOUSLY IF MICHELLE WIE IS GOING TO GET HER FIRST WIN, THE LAST THING SHE NEEDS IS TO FOCUS ON THE FACT THAT SHE HAS YET TO WIN. The next to the last thing she needs is to have everybody talking about how she has never won. And it really doesn't help to have someone pretend to be friendly and suggest that it would have been better for her to stay an amateur and win the US Womens Open like Tiger did thrice. The idea here being that since she already turned pro, it is now too late for her, her life is over, and she should just go out and kill herself.




08/08/06 @ 13:12
Comment from: Jenny [Visitor]
Agree with you Jim C.

Morgan drawing attention to Michelle's final round of 82 last year was very poor sportsmanship from The Mouth and shows her obsession with Michelle.

Poor pathetic Morgan, she wants to beat Michelle so bad yet she can't seem to do so even when Michelle plays bad as she did at the Br Open



08/08/06 @ 13:37
Comment from: Jim C [Visitor]
Did anyone see Dot Wong's blog and her link to a Laura Baugh article? Laura Baugh talked about how her amateur success gave her the confidence to believe she could win everything at the LPGA level, and bragged about how she never went into a tournament just trying to make the cut.

If Wie's fans are going to compare her to Tiger Woods, I guess it is only fair that the youngest winner of a US Women's Amateur should talk about the confidence she gained from winning as an amateur in much the same way that people talk about the confidence Tiger got.

But Laura Baugh never did win in the pros--and I have to wonder whether the confidence she gained from her success as an amateur and her distain for just trying to make a cut helped lead to the alcohol addiction that nearly killed her. Laura Baugh sneers at Wie's efforts to just make the cut on the PGA--but I think it would have been a good learning experience for Laura Baugh if she had played in a PGA event and shot a couple of rounds in the 120s to miss the cut by 100 strokes. Perhaps she would have been better able to deal with the losing that was to be a part of her apprenticeship in the LPGA.
08/08/06 @ 14:45
Comment from: Ghet Rheel [Visitor]
to: Go Michelle - I posted this (below) earlier on another blog - GM, I think we wonder the same things about AstroAlex and his imaginary friends...

A possible explanation for a half dozen or so adults spending untold hours discussing someone they say they have very little regard for... Astroturf. Astroturf is the industry term for phoney Public Relations campaigns that try to appear to be "grassroots" movements. Alex (and his imaginary friends) show all the earmarks of astroturf blog writers.

So, Alex is either being paid minimum wage or so to attack a fine young golfer, or is being led by the nose in his views by a more sophisticated astroturf writer. True to form, Alex denies the existance of such astroturf PR campaigins - says it is delusional to think such thoughts (pretty weak stuff, Alex, even for you)

Anyone can go to Google and type in "astroturf" and "blog". The Wall Street Jounal wrote a piece on Public Relations astroturf last week.

I just typed in "astroturf" and "blog" on Google - got over 500,000 hits

08/08/06 @ 15:01
Comment from: Kyle [Visitor]

Don't buy your BS Alex,

I've been a long time subscriber to SI , and no such thing has ever been printed about BJ Wie.

Quit making up stuff man but I guess it doesn't matter because you have as much credibility as Anna Nicole Smith.
08/08/06 @ 15:14
Comment from: Jim C [Visitor]
A 42 year old woman defeated Michelle Wie by 13 shots at The British Women's Open. Next month the 40 year old man who wanted to play in the British Women's Open gets his chance to see if he can do any better.
08/08/06 @ 16:28
Comment from: Ghet Rheel [Visitor]
Wie's caddie Greg Johnston fired

Golf Digest's Ron Sirak reports in the past hour that Johnston was released shortly after the Womens British Open.

While Johnston is a top pro looper, there was not a great chemistry between player and caddie. It is never pleasant to fire anyone (or be fired, for that matter), but it is sometimes the only choice remaining. I think this move shows that Wie's management team has the strength to make tough decisions when required.
08/08/06 @ 17:47
Comment from: George [Visitor]
Get Real

*****
I think this move shows that Wie's management team has the strength to make tough decisions when required.
*****

Hey, Wie Warriors, what do you folks think of St. Michelle, who is above skepticism or criticism, according to Get Real and others, in light of this comment from her ex-caddie?

*****
"I was shocked and surprised, I thought we had a successful year," Johnston told GolfDigest.com. "And I was extremely disappointed that no one named Wie gave me the news."
*****

so let's see. Either Michelle didn't have the guts to let him know, or B.J. Wie didn't. If Michelle is running the show, as some of the Wie Warriors maintain, then she apparently has a character flaw whereby she doesn't have the courtesy to let one of her top employees know he was being dismissed.

If B.J. Wie is running the show, then it brings his character into question.

-George
08/08/06 @ 17:57
Comment from: Johnny N. [Visitor]
Good decision to get rid of the caddie.

He made a number of mistakes and she deserves better.
08/08/06 @ 18:01
Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
Ghet Rheel, Well, you got me. Operation Astroturf has been put on hold indefinitely. Special Ops are now searching for the leak. I will probably be transfered to one of the other tin foil hat conspiracy issues, maybe the construction of concentration camps or black surveillance helicopters. If you and Kyle need a job, I'll put in a word for you both.
08/08/06 @ 18:34
Comment from: Ghet Rheel [Visitor]
Johnston didn't cut it as Wie's caddie. Wie's (William Morris) agent fired him. That's the way it works in sports management these days. Johnston didn't like the way he got fired? Who ever LIKES the way they get fired?

I agree with Johnny N. - Good decision.
08/08/06 @ 19:01
Comment from: Greg [Visitor]
That the more simple minded the subject...the more simple minded some of the respondents. It's amazing to listen to people who really believe Michelle Wie should have done something other than she's done...pretending to know the future and what her record will or won't look like when she is 22 or 23.
If I'd been her father I would have encouraged her to do precisely what she's done. What makes someone like John Z think her father did this to make himself rich? In fact, if anyone is "pimping" it's John Z...other than a two bit opinion and a great deal of envy what support, other than his large mouth, does he bring to the table for his bias??
Michelle is propbably the most physically mature athlete for her age I've seen..and certainly one of the most intelligent. By the by...John Z...please tell me what high level Amateur events Tom Watson won before he turned Pro...did you know he had to get financial assistance from a group of his father's friends before he could attempt the PGA Tour? No...I'll bet you didn't.
08/09/06 @ 00:38
Comment from: Greg [Visitor]
Brandon, that you believe Wie should have been in the Amateur...tell me, what other significant assessments have you also made? Perhaps you can enlighten us why someone would give up millions of dollars to pursue YOUR agenda? Do women in general take you seriously...or do you simply act that pretentious on your Blog site???
I would like someone to please tell us if they saw Tiger play when he was 16...and if he was better that Wie..because I saw Johnny Miller play at 16..and he wasn't even close to her.
08/09/06 @ 00:46
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
"Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
Kyle, This may come as a surprise to you, but when one is a spectator at a golf tournament, one frequently comes within arm's length of the golfers themselves including all the big names. Nothing at all unusual about that. BJ Wie never tries to hide his enthusiasm, which is understandable. But his actions when the other golfers are addressing the ball are so egregious that he has been chided by marshals several times. BJ Wie's antics have been witnessed by thousands of golf spectators and have been documented in several news articles and magazines including SI. The fact that you don't know this is testament to your abysmal ignorance on the subject."

Another "Urban Legend" gathers moss and rolls nowhere.

BJ is a non-issue that for some reason is demonized by some ignorant members of the media. If he speaks Korean (his native language) he is accused of coaching. If he gets excited when his daughter plays well, he is accused of disturbing the other players.

First; most members of the media are ignorant of his culture. Koreans speak loudly, with gutteral sounds as points of emphasis. This sounds harsh to Western ears, but is quite normal to a Korean. This might sound like a scolding to a Westerner, but it really is nothing more than talking in their normal tone of voice.

Second; In Korean culture family is everything and I mean absolutely everything. Korean parents will sacrifice all to promote the success of their offspring. This was bred into the culture of Korea during the Yi Dynasty and explains the success of Korean women on the LPGA tour today. Their fathers and mothers were no different than BJ or Bo Wie.

Third; Koreans are very reserved in public and a Westerner might see this as stand offish or stuck up. When you watch a Korean player they are not prone to smile very much and appear in total concentration. They seem cold and distant to the public and not very approachable. What would surprise most people is how warm, friendly and carefree a people they are out of the public eye. The media does not get to see this side of Korean life, so they just form an opinion of the public persona.

Finally; Koreans who learn English as a second language continue to translate from English to Korean in their minds and then from Korean to English in their response. No matter how educated they are sometimes things don't come out exactly as they intended. An ignorant person may not take this into account and misunderstand the message from a non-native speaker. Michelle because she learned English at a young age will think and speak in both languages, switching from one to another without this translation process taking place.

BJ is just a Dad showing his love and support in the Korean way.







08/09/06 @ 07:39
Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
One-Putt, That is all very interesting. How does BJ Wie operate in the US when Korean culture is so ingrained in him? Is he still a professor of some sort? Does he still work in his field, or does he manage Bubbles' career exclusively? Did he just crawl out of a bomb crater at Inchon? Or does he just refuse to adopt US customs and mores? Inquiring minds want to know.
08/09/06 @ 09:21
Comment from: Jim COULTHARD [Visitor]
GEORGE

Michelle's ex-caddy said he thought Michelle had a good year. Do you agree with him?
08/09/06 @ 14:19
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
The Koreans I know who have immigrated to another country will accept the customs of the country they are living in, but never fully embrace the culture or eliminate their own from their daily life.

They gravitate to a Korean community within the country they are living in, thus providing a network of their own culture. Their best friends will be other Koreans who live in the community where they will worship in Korean churches, shop in Korean markets and eat in Korean resturants out of preferance. In fact they will use Korean lawyers Alex, creating a sub-culture within our own.

Unless you're blinded by hate, you may not have noticed the Korean community in your area Alex, where the largest population of Koreans live in the USA. All the major cities have Korean communities providing a support network and a link to their own culture.

There are directories published in Hangul for most major cities around the World to assist traveling Koreans in connecting with their culture away from their residence.

Koreans will go to a Western resturant with you Alex, but when they get home they will crave a bowl of rice and kinchi before they sleep.

As a guess I would say Michelle's closest friends are children of other Koreans who she will feel most comfortable with and connect culturally with. Hawaii has a very large Korean sub-culture.



08/09/06 @ 14:44
Comment from: putt4par [Visitor]
One-putt, it is very obvious from the somewhat silly questions and responses that Alex comes up with, that he has never lived in an ethnic community. I mean a community that is not of his ethnic background.
I don't mean being a soldier on furlough in a foriegn land, I mean live in that community, grow up in it, and have your kids grow up in it.

They function quite well in American culture but revert almost entirely to their own culture when at home and amongst their ethnic friends and relatives. I grew up in that kind of community, I know what they are like.

It is also quite noticable that Alex has an obvious prejudice for Americans against any other culture.
His childish observations and comments do not make me want to hire him or his "firm" for any of my legal work, if he is indeed a lawyer as he would have us believe. Most lawyers would die before publishing the kind of garbage the Alex spews forth in this blog.
08/09/06 @ 16:36
Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
putt4par, You couldn't afford to hire me or anyone from my firm. But by law, you can obtain the services of a public defender if your problem is criminal or the local Legal Aid Society if your need is civil representation. Your depiction of the home life of teenage Americans of Korean ancestry is laughable. I reside in a Northwest suburb of Chicago in Lake county. Lake county has more than 100,000 people of Asian extraction living here. My own community has several thousand such citizens. All I've met, and I am on a first-name basis with several, are great people. p4p, to say that you do not know what the hell you're talking about is an understatement.
08/09/06 @ 17:54
Comment from: putt4par [Visitor]
Alex, you poor silly little sod. You have no idea, none at all about me.

Your view of the world is colored by money and position. Snobbery, elitism and social climbers.
And you actually know some of these Asian people? Wow, good for you. By reading your little nuisance responses in these blogs, I am amazed that you would lower yourself to mingle with "teenage Americans of Korean ancestry".

I must commend you, little snob, you done good.
08/09/06 @ 18:12
Comment from: Ghet Rheel [Visitor]
One-Putt

Thank you for your carefully considered insights into Korean-American culture. One of the most intriguing elements of the Wie story is the cross-cultural impact she is already having. Her family has shown wisdom in encouraging her to study Korean, Japanese, and Chinese, in addition to her native English. (In my household we claim her as an All-American girl). She'll be a valued ambassador throughout Asia and beyond for years to come.

At lunch yesterday I had a rather serious-looking Korean waitress and a bored-looking Chinese busboy. Neither spoke much English. The busboy was in his teens and the waitress was in her 50's. I asked "do you know Michelle Wie?" Both of their faces lit up instantly. You could feel the pride. "Very good golfer!" the woman beamed. I then asked, "Do you know Se Ri Pak?" They responded, "Is she good too?"

There is something happening with MW that transcends most any sport story that I've ever seen. I feel sorry for those who are unable to enjoy it. I'm having a ball watching the saga unfold.
08/09/06 @ 21:12
Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
Ghet Rheel, Don't quit your day job. Aesop's Fables have already been written. How about the one at the Chinese laundry. You know, "no tickee, no washee."
08/09/06 @ 22:08
Comment from: Ghet Rheel [Visitor]
putt4parr and One-Putt

We see you are learning to deal with the resident fool. Here are a few notes on the care and feeding of AstroAlex:

If you want to punish him, just ignore him - drives him into deep dispair. Don't ignore him for too long as he may go away. All Wie supporters agree that we could not invent a better poster boy for the anti-Wie faction than AstroAlex. So, to keep him around (for the greater good) he does need to be verbally bitch-slapped on every third or fourth day. He craves this treatment and and while it is distasteful to administer, we fear we'd lose him without it. Good luck. Others will help out when they can.
08/09/06 @ 23:08
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
"Comment from: Ghet Rheel [Visitor]
One-Putt

Thank you for your carefully considered insights into Korean-American culture. One of the most intriguing elements of the Wie story is the cross-cultural impact she is already having. Her family has shown wisdom in encouraging her to study Korean, Japanese, and Chinese, in addition to her native English. (In my household we claim her as an All-American girl). She'll be a valued ambassador throughout Asia and beyond for years to come."

Just a note; Chinese is taught to students in Korea since all official records are maintained in Chinese characters. If a student aspires to work for the Korean government, Chinese is a requirement.

Michelle learning Japanese is a bit of surprise since most Koreans still feel a deep resentment for Japan and their occupation of Korea. Japanese was the only language allowed to be taught in schools during the occupation and Hangul was taught as an underground language. Teachers of Hangul would be severly punished or tortured if caught. It is a miracle the language survived.

Japanese does make sense when you consider the popularity of women's golf in Japan. The LPGA could only hope to be half as popular and they would be highly successful.
08/10/06 @ 02:48
Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
Ghet Rheel, Got any more fairy tales about Korean waitresses and Chinese busboys? That first one wasn't all that bad. It could have been embellished a little more. Like your Astroturf fables.
08/10/06 @ 08:12
Comment from: Merrin [Visitor]
uh..by the way, not everone who says Michelle might have been bettr off extending her stay as an amateur & learning more about her golf game before playing with the big dogs has ANY of that sentiment being rooted in her ethnicity.

sweet Jesus what did this turn into?
08/10/06 @ 10:51
Comment from: Ghet Rheel [Visitor]
One-Putt - a few quotes:

Matt Slater, BBC, golf editor:
“Tall, good-looking and articulate, Wie is already fluent in Korean and is studying Japanese and Chinese. It is no scheduling accident that her second pro event will be against men in Japan.”

AP wire report:
“Several hundred people were at the airport to greet Wie as she stepped off the private jet flown from her home in Honolulu to Japan. "Konnichiwa, I am very much moved by your welcome," the sixteen-year-old said in Japanese. "I will do my best and please cheer for me!"

Brent Kelly, “About Golf” reporter:
“We can expect to see Wie playing more tournaments around the world, and particularly in Asia where Wie's heritage - her parents are Korean - and her ability to speak Korean, Japanese and Chinese make her extremely attractive to companies in the growing Asian market. According to espn.com's Darren Rovell, 20-percent of all golf merchandise in the world is sold in Japan, and 40-percent of Nike's sales take place outside the U.S.”
08/10/06 @ 10:52
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
"Comment from: Merrin [Visitor]
uh..by the way, not everone who says Michelle might have been bettr off extending her stay as an amateur & learning more about her golf game before playing with the big dogs has ANY of that sentiment being rooted in her ethnicity.

sweet Jesus what did this turn into?"

But Merrin, it has everything to do with her culture and ethnicity.

That is the link and why she is taking the path in front of her. Koreans are a determined people who are driven to achieve their goals. Westerners will look at this as stubborn or willful to a fault. A Korean looks upon this behavior quite differently.

The best analogy to describe this commitment was given to me by a elderly Korean friend in Seoul:

Every Korean child starts off at the bottom of a high mountain (he used Soraksan as an example) that affords them a wonderful view of the World when they reach the top.

The journey to the top will be most difficult and filled with danger along the way. Many obsticals will face them on the path to the top that will block their way and they will have to go over or around them to keep climbing to the summit. There are Tigers, Bears and Wild Boar they must avoid on the way up to the peak. Sometimes they will slip and fall back down the mountain path, but they must gather themselves and keep trying as the view is just too beautiful to miss.

As they move towards the top of the mountain they are growing stronger and the climb is getting easier for them until finally they reach the top of the World.

The view is quite spectacular looking out at the sea to the East where the sun rises above the water over the mist at the mountain base. They begin to think there can be no better view of the World and they have achieved everything in life. Then they turn to the North and spot another mountain in the distance rising above the mist, a much larger one. The young man (no longer a child) looks longingly at this mountain and says to himself, "I just know the view from that mountain will be much better than the one I just climbed. I'll go find out."

Korea has many beautiful mountains and Michelle has just become a young woman who is very close to reaching the summit of Soraksan.



08/10/06 @ 14:44
Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
One-Putt, Did the elderly Korean gentleman who delivered that stirring bit of prose speak in Korean or English? Is it verbatim or a loose translation? If it's the former, he speaks the absolute best English of any Asian person in history. If it's the latter, you have a greater ability in Korean to English translation and interpretation than 99.9% of Asian scholars in this country. If you are that good, congratulations are due you.
08/10/06 @ 15:39
Comment from: John Z [Visitor]
One Putt, By your posts you seem to know a lot about Korea. I spent a little time in country in Korea myself. From 21July1950 until 16Feb1952. I returned for a visit in the summer of 1990. Things had changed dramatically by then. The young people in Korea that I saw were pretty decent kids, but they seemed to be very materialistic and oriented to consumer goods than they were idealistic. It was two years after the Olympics and the sports they were the craziest about were baseball and boxing. I don't think the golf craze had started yet. Once during my stay some guys who were supposed to be students but looked a lot older started an anti-American riot complete with Molotov cocktails. Stayed at the Gen. Walker hotel and had a few good sessions at the blackjack tables in the casino there.
08/10/06 @ 18:02
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
"Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
One-Putt, Did the elderly Korean gentleman who delivered that stirring bit of prose speak in Korean or English?"

He speaks only elementary English Alex and it is my translation from memory. Koreans are very eloquent orators if you understand the language and can open your ears. It is as accurate as a Westerner can translate it for you.

George, Walker Hill Resort was the first government casino opened in Korea. I was at the opening and cleaned up pretty well myself. Apparently their training program for dealers was lacking and they were flipping cards when the house should have stood pat. I noticed our windfall didn't last very long after they hired some Chinese dealers from Macau to take over their training.

Golf was always a Rich Man's sport in Korea and still is today. Your average Korean can go to a driving range and that is about it. That is why most of the Korean LPGA players have such mechanical swings, from hitting tens of thousands of balls on a driving range. Once they became good enough they could pay entrance fees to enter amateur events. In the past there were no public golf courses in Korea and private ones cost several hundred thousand dollars to purchase a membership share, plus around 7,000 to 10,000 Won to play a round each time.

You were very observant in your description of the "older" students starting a riot. They are simply paid hooligans hired to stir up trouble by the opposition during election time. It is sort of a tradition now, much like the Democratic Party and their Resident Hooligan, Howard Dean.

08/11/06 @ 02:59
Comment from: nem alma cihazi [Visitor]
Ev,Havuz ve Endüstriyel Tip Nem Alma Cihazları.Nem Sorununuza %100 Çözüm.
01/14/11 @ 09:20

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